I Have a Fender Supersonic 22W. It is an open back combo. It has an Eminence-built Fender Lightning 12" 8ohm speaker. The clean isnt too bad though a bit bright. It is supposedly based on the /delexe Reverb platform. I play lots of 70s 80s rock and the drive channel just sounds small and weightless. It does however have reasonable note articulation even with the gain really high. I dont want just a dark heavy sounding speaker or anything that muddies the notes of a rhythm chord. I saw that a NV music store has a one-off version of the amp with Vintage 30 installed that sounds pretty good through streamed youtube type demo, but have never really heard them a/b. I fully realize that this amp is a bit too ambitious trying to be a DR and a high gain screamer in an a 1x12 cab, but a JCM800 + 4x12 AND a black face twin are not in my immediate future, and this thing is way more portable.
Okay, so ... go out & borrow a 10 gauge double barrel shotgun ... that gives you two shots to annihilate that "Lightning 12" ... you'll be doing humanity a big favor!
Then, buy a Retro 30 & fall in love with that amp! Post back w/ your results!
Vaughn, what do you think about this for the Super-Sonic 22? In another thread you said the Ret30 was a very bright speaker and that you didn't prefer it for open back cabs which is what the SS22 is. One advantage for the Ret30 is that I would think it would have the Jensen-like bite that the Fender Eminence has.
I still think the ret should work well in the ss22 ... Yes, partly because it will have the vintage Jensen like chime that most people expect from a Fender ... And also because the supersonic line has pretty powerful tone stacks that can sculpt the big bottom and extended top of the ret 30 into whatever you want.
the invader is a very different speaker ... It has a good bit of GB midrange urgent snarl ... But with a good bit more versatility ... I'm really starting to love that speaker. If you do try one in the SS22 ... Please be sure to post back here with your results.
Just posting some results: I ended up buying the Retro 30 to put into the SS22, and it was an excellent choice. There is still enough top end to keep the Fender signature sound, but the Retro has enough midrange focus to make it cut through, especially with the Super Sonic's overdrive. There are NO in-your-face highs, and in fact I've goosed the treble control up a notch. It's a great sound, especially using bridge pickups.
As a bonus, I bought an open back Blackstar speaker cab for under $200, threw out the Celestion 70/30, and slapped in a Reaper HP that I already had. Using the Reaper and the Retro together is a great combo. A thick, yet crystal clear sound when played clean, and lots of nasty snarl when pushed without sounding honky. I love it.
I had posted a comment here that hasn't made it on this thread (as of yet), but I discovered an unlikely WGS combination that I have fallen in love with. There is a lot of support for a combo of the Reaper (I have the HP) and the Retro 30. Originally, I used this combination and liked it, as I posted earlier, but it also had a <em>lot</em> of warmth, too much for my tastes. I must also disclose I was using the Reaper HP in cavernous Blackstar 1x12 open-back cab which I'm sure was adding to the bassy character.
I also have a G12C that I was using in another cab, and for the heck of it, paired it with the the Retro and believe it or not, this is a NICE combination. The bass is much tighter and there is the Fender brightness and chime that comes from the Retro and the G12, yet the Retro gives the sound a good midrange body and a tasty snarl when turned up. What I likely will do is replace the Special Design Eminence with the Retro in the combo cab, and pair it with the G12 in the Blackstar cabinet (to give that speaker some bottom end and calm the highs). The Retro will sound better and better as it gets broken in.
I now have about 15 hours on the Retro 30 with the Supersonic 22, and I can tell you I am in love with this speaker. I don't find ice-picky at all (as I feared) and it has that sweet chime and that nice fat-ness when used with my Strat with the D. Allen Johnny Hiland Blade pickups. Thank you, Vaughn, for the suggestion in this thread!
Awesome, and also, thanks for taking the time to post back here with your results. I knew from my experience that the SS22 & Ret 30 should make a good paring, but I'd never actually tried it! You have now confirmed my suspicions!
Oh, and also ... yea, me and Brad did a bunch of 2x12 pairings a while back, and were surprised to find how the G12 paired with others ... some pairings we thought would ROCK, like the ET65/G12 didn't work at all ... and some we didn't think would work ... like the Retro 30/G12 worked well.
Hi - im also looking for a replacement speaker for my Supersonic 22, and had more or less settled on the Retro 30, until I realised the comparisons with the V30. I've owned V30s before, and didn't like them at all. I like a nice clean Fender sound, and smooth overdrive, I find Celestions to be throaty and aggressive. I have a WGS G12C in my Blues Deluxe, and I've played the Supersonic through it, sounds great, but Id like to try something different for the SS22. So, any other "American" sounding suggestions? Or do you still reckon go with the Retro 30? Thanks in advance.
Gents, please allow me to chime back in here. I own a V30 cab that came in a Carvin V3M setup (ugh) and I tried it with the 22 and I can tell you with certainty that the Ret30 and the V30 really do not sound alike. To my ears, the v30 was dark and somewhat lifeless and broke up too easily. The Ret30 sounds much more Fender/Jensen-ish with a sparkly top end, but also has a sweet midrange that allows for those creamy pristine Strat neck or out-of-phase pickup sounds in the vein of SRV's Rivera Paradise or Hendrix's Voodoo Chile (the slow version).
I'm very happy with the setup and Vaughn's intuitive suggestion (even though he hadn't heard the actual combo) was spot on. The only other speaker I would consider in the 22 is the G12C/S as the SS22 is a bright amp. Just my 3 cents worth.
Just a little update- got the Retro30, and yes, sounds great in the SS22, but out of curiosity, I put in the G12C, and omigawd! Beautiful chiming, detailed, perfectly Fender sound. Gigged it Saturday night, and am loving it. So, Sunday afternoon, nothing to do, I decided to try the Retro30 in my Blues Deluxe, and, for the second time in a week... Omigawd! I thought I loved the Blues Deluxe before, but the Retro30 turns it into one of my favourite amps ever. There's a new texture that was never there before, a little haze around the notes that was missing. Even the drive channel sounds good, it has the qualities I want from a tweed amp. So, double thankyous to WGS.
Interesting results with your G12 and the Blues Deluxe. I also have that amp and I ended up pairing the Reaper HP with it, and so far, I'm liking the results. It's slightly warm so I have to goose the treble up a bit, but I play a lot of jazz, so it fits me perfectly. I also have a V30 that I put in a tweed Fender closed back extension cab, and the combo of it and the Reaper was my version of "Omigawd."
For my Supersonic 22/Ret 30, I am using the G12 in an open-back extension cab with a beam blocker installed. I haven't had a chance to use this combo at stage volume on a gig, but it sounds great at low volumes. I'll post more after the next job in a few weeks.
I acquired a SuperSonic 22 today. I now realize that one very important consideration with this amp is: What channel are we most concerned about? The two channels behave so differently!
Initial impressions:
"Vintage" channel is nice - it's a better clone of a "good" BF Deluxe Reverb than the actual DRRI, in fact ... and the "fat" voicing is a quite useful alternative. Tone controls seem more powerful and musical than the DRRI, too.
"Burn" channel is "meh" at best. The interaction between Gain 1 & Gain 2 is taking some getting used to ... reminds me of the early Boogies built from a Princeton. So far, I'm thinking a good pedal in front of the Vintage channel sounds better.
Reverb is excellent! Among the finest ever ...
In the upcoming months, I'll let ya all know how my speaker comparisons go :-)
Wampler Pinnacle Deluxe. Nice pedal that eloquently covers a LOT of ground.
BTW: I actually really like the stock speaker in the SS22 ... but I just ran it into my "new" '64 Bassman cab with open-back and a pair of Reapers, and ... wow! Very tasty, and plenty of volume for any situation I'd ever find myself in! It really helps bring some complexity to the gain channel, too (I refuse to call it the "burn" channel).
When I get a chance I'll do 1x12 shootouts with the SS22.